Talk:On the Origin of Species: Mew

Actually, it is implied that all Pokemon are the same species

Barring Oddish, well, you could, through breeding and leaving out ditto, connect all gendered, non legendaries to each other. So Mew containing the DNA of all accessable Pokemon (Arceus is not accessable) isn't that Farfetch'd (pardon the pun). With ditto in the mix, all Pokemon other than legendaries are connected, and legendaries may merely require specific breeding conditions. So all Pokemon being subspecies of the... Let's say Pokemon Pokemon Species because I'm lazy may not be that out there --Shadowater 05:05, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Was it implied somewhere that humans and pokemon are related? I seem to recall that it was. PLA 08:25, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Legendaries are a more complicated idea. Arceus, Dialga, Palkia and Giratina almost definitely came before Mew. It would seem Kyogre, Groudon and Rayquaza also pre-dated Mew. The possible reasoning behind (most) legendaries inability to breed might be because they were never meant to. Arceus created them during the formation of the Pokémon world to be solitary assistants in creating it or protecting it once it was finished. Perhaps the Pokédex is wrong and Mew is the origin of a majority of Pokémon, linking all that can breed with Ditto, but this is all speculation of course.-N-Pie 09:34, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

By the real-world definition of the term "species" - Animals are considered to be different species when they aren't genetically compatible with each other - you could indeed class most Pokemon as members of a single, super-diverse species. The closest thing we have in reality to this is dogs: They can be very different, and yet they can all breed with each other.

However, when referring to Pokemon, we mostly use the word "species" to mean individual Pokemon. Even though the actual in-game definition of "species" is even more spurious (it refers to those useless classifications, like "Mouse Pokemon"). George Hutcheon 17:08, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Arceus being the ultimate creator, I think, is more myth than history in the Pokemon universe. It seems are more plausible that people in Sinnoh observed Palkia and Dialga's influences on time and space, and came to believe (erroneously) that they were the creators of Time and Space. And then, when they observed at Sinjoh (before it became a Ruins) that Arceus was able to "create" Palkia and Dialga, they concluded that Arceus is the ultimate creator of the universe. I'd also suggest that the involvement of the Unown in this creation process also suggests that the Sinnoh religion isn't entirely accurate. Given this, I think it's reasonable to suggest that Mew came before Arceus, etc. Aielyn 03:06, 6 October 2010 (UTC)

Evolution in the Pokémon world might be predetermined in Mew's DNA

Evolution in Pokémon would seem to work differently than in reality. Pokémon evolution is more like metamorphosis and you can be predict exactly what a one Pokémon, for example Pikachu, will evolve into, in this case a Raichu. The predetermined nature of evolution in Pokémon would perhaps be explained by Mew containing the DNA of all the Pokémon, rather than that setting off your nerd-senses about evolutionary misconception. Remember, the Pokémon world is a strange place. Real world science doesn't necessarily hold true there.-N-Pie 09:43, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Talk of evolution within the series is complicated by the fact that there are actually two kinds of evolution at work here: the one that's a mechanic in the games (essentially metamorphosis) and something more akin to actual evolution, which must have occurred if Mew is the ancestor of other Pokemon. I would consider these processes to be entirely separate, but it's hard to discuss them because they both have the same name. George Hutcheon 17:08, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Whilst it's to be assumed two types of evolution must have occurred, it's hard to see through which method Pokémon species diverged. Breeding is an odd concept because whilst traits such as particular moves and abilities are transferable, Pokémon within an egg group do not create hybrids in other ways. Of course, without any more official information it would be impossible to draw any solid conclusions, and because anything is possible there could be almost any reason to explain the Pokédex entry.-N-Pie 21:28, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Mew as a second origin of life

As mentioned in the article, the "single universal ancestor" concept is fairly well-accepted in scientific circles today. But perhaps in the Pokemon universe, pokemon are actually part of a second, distinct ancestry of life, with Mew being the ancestor for pokemon, but not for other life. After all, there are ordinary plants, and the anime has apparently shown the existence of some non-pokemon animals, not to mention the humans themselves. If we assume this, and also assume that the first Mew came to exist relatively recently (compared with that of non-Pokemon), it would make sense for the variety of genes to be relatively limited, and thus it is plausible that Mew began with the genes that all other pokemon share, with variations being predominantly due to active vs inactive genes, along with mutations that occurred due to various effects (such as the impact of the various evolutionary stones). As others have pointed out, pokemon are basically a single species, based on breeding patterns - it seems that the only thing keeping most pokemon from breeding is willingness to actually copulate with those of various other species, or perhaps physiological incompatibility. That two seemingly-unrelated pokemon can breed, and the result looks like the mother specifically, suggests that most pokemon share near-identical genomes. Aielyn 03:17, 6 October 2010 (UTC)